# 23.976 to PAL. Am I doing this right? **URL:** \ **Category:** Flame Questions\ **Created:** [November 3, 2021, 7:20pm UTC](https://forum.logik.tv/t/23-976-to-pal-am-i-doing-this-right/4274 "2021-11-03T19:20:22Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 15\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![MLandon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@MLandon](https://forum.logik.tv/u/MLandon)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2021, 7:20pm UTC](https://forum.logik.tv/t/23-976-to-pal-am-i-doing-this-right/4274/1 "2021-11-03T19:20:22Z")
Hey all, I have a spot mastered at 23.976 that I’ve been asked to make PAL for a UK version. I am going about the conversion by making a new sequence at 50i and dropping my clip into it. Is this the best way to do it? Convert Rate will make a 25fps clip, but it will be progressive. so I’m thinking the 50i is the better way to go. Any thoughts out there? Thanks in advance, Michael ---
**Author:** ![andy\_dill](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex020/user_avatar/forum.logik.tv/andy_dill/32/15475_2.png) [@andy\_dill](https://forum.logik.tv/u/andy_dill)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2021, 8:13pm UTC](https://forum.logik.tv/t/23-976-to-pal-am-i-doing-this-right/4274/2 "2021-11-03T20:13:40Z")
If you’ve got the source timeline, you can timewarp a ref out to 750f (assuming a 720f master) and then extend each of the handles by 1-2 frames, using the timewarped ref as a guide. I wouldn’t interlace anything. Better to double every 24th frame. all the masters I made when I lived in the UK were 25p. ---
**Author:** ![MLandon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@MLandon](https://forum.logik.tv/u/MLandon)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2021, 8:18pm UTC](https://forum.logik.tv/t/23-976-to-pal-am-i-doing-this-right/4274/3 "2021-11-03T20:18:22Z")
Interesting. Thanks for the answer @andy_dill ! I was interlacing it because the spec called for it. I was playing around with 50i because it’s just running the fields at 50 which produces a 25fps picture. Honestly it all looks like crap on my progressive monitor. I think you’re right though. I’m going to do it a at 25 with a progressive TW. Thanks again! ---
**Author:** ![randy](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex020/user_avatar/forum.logik.tv/randy/32/6122_2.png) [@randy](https://forum.logik.tv/u/randy)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2021, 8:44pm UTC](https://forum.logik.tv/t/23-976-to-pal-am-i-doing-this-right/4274/4 "2021-11-03T20:44:13Z")
Or do Pal Pulldown. Clip / Pulldown / Pal . Adds the perfect repeated frame sequence for 24 to 25. ---
**Author:** ![MLandon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@MLandon](https://forum.logik.tv/u/MLandon)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2021, 8:44pm UTC](https://forum.logik.tv/t/23-976-to-pal-am-i-doing-this-right/4274/5 "2021-11-03T20:44:57Z")
I didn’t even know there was a PAL pulldown! 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![randy](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex020/user_avatar/forum.logik.tv/randy/32/6122_2.png) [@randy](https://forum.logik.tv/u/randy)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2021, 12:25am UTC](https://forum.logik.tv/t/23-976-to-pal-am-i-doing-this-right/4274/6 "2021-11-04T00:25:51Z")
Im faily certain that most specs that request 50i are outdated nonsense. I mean, who really wants interlacing these days? I think what they are doing is repeating old stuff whereas, yes, they want 50i, but each field happens TO BE THE FECKING SAME. Therefore, 50i = 25p. So, I suspect that 25p or 25 legit film frames per sec would work. I hope. ---
**Author:** ![AndyBrown](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex020/user_avatar/forum.logik.tv/andybrown/32/708_2.png) [@AndyBrown](https://forum.logik.tv/u/AndyBrown)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2021, 2:23am UTC](https://forum.logik.tv/t/23-976-to-pal-am-i-doing-this-right/4274/7 "2021-11-04T02:23:14Z")
That is correct. You can tag it as 50i, but it’s really just 25p. ---
**Author:** ![cnoellert](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex020/user_avatar/forum.logik.tv/cnoellert/32/559_2.png) [@cnoellert](https://forum.logik.tv/u/cnoellert)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2021, 2:43am UTC](https://forum.logik.tv/t/23-976-to-pal-am-i-doing-this-right/4274/8 "2021-11-04T02:43:57Z")
Actually man, the only delivery format was 50i in the same way that pal was 50i because you would just nest 25psf into 50i the same way you would do with pal. 25P with a capital P never was a thing for the masses mainly because the only deck that could take it was the D6. D5 and HDCAM(SR) we’re all 50i and down-converted to pal in the machine. So the standard remained the same 50i as 625 but with a bigger raster… at least until tape died. That being the case don’t deliver a fielded master just because you can. That’s almost definitely not the expectation. Either: 1. deliver frame for frame and pitch the audio or 2. add a progressive pal based pull down or 3. split up all the clips, ML timewarp from 24 to 25 and reassemble the edit. ---
**Author:** ![randy](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex020/user_avatar/forum.logik.tv/randy/32/6122_2.png) [@randy](https://forum.logik.tv/u/randy)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2021, 3:30am UTC](https://forum.logik.tv/t/23-976-to-pal-am-i-doing-this-right/4274/9 "2021-11-04T03:30:08Z")
1. Add a frame of handles per second. ---
**Author:** ![cnoellert](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex020/user_avatar/forum.logik.tv/cnoellert/32/559_2.png) [@cnoellert](https://forum.logik.tv/u/cnoellert)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2021, 3:31am UTC](https://forum.logik.tv/t/23-976-to-pal-am-i-doing-this-right/4274/10 "2021-11-04T03:31:58Z")
For sure in a perfect world you just recut the whole thing. But editors and their ins-and-outs, you feel me? I’ve been told more than once that the cuts remain as they are… as stupid as it sounds. ---
**Author:** ![johnt](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex020/user_avatar/forum.logik.tv/johnt/32/14040_2.png) [@johnt](https://forum.logik.tv/u/johnt)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2021, 7:27am UTC](https://forum.logik.tv/t/23-976-to-pal-am-i-doing-this-right/4274/11 "2021-11-04T07:27:22Z")
@DaveWishart ---
**Author:** ![DaveWishart](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a88e57/32.png) [@DaveWishart](https://forum.logik.tv/u/DaveWishart)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2021, 7:32am UTC](https://forum.logik.tv/t/23-976-to-pal-am-i-doing-this-right/4274/12 "2021-11-04T07:32:18Z")
Hi @johnt. @randy and @andy_dill said it all. Seconded. ---
**Author:** ![DaveWishart](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a88e57/32.png) [@DaveWishart](https://forum.logik.tv/u/DaveWishart)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2021, 7:58am UTC](https://forum.logik.tv/t/23-976-to-pal-am-i-doing-this-right/4274/13 "2021-11-04T07:58:35Z")
Oh, one more thing. Unless you’re delivering a clocked master direct to broadcast, keep it 25p. Like Randy said 50i would have both fields the same so wouldn’t matter much if you didn’t but we only tag our masters at 50i on export when they’re heading to the TV stations. ---
**Author:** ![MLandon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@MLandon](https://forum.logik.tv/u/MLandon)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2021, 11:00am UTC](https://forum.logik.tv/t/23-976-to-pal-am-i-doing-this-right/4274/14 "2021-11-04T11:00:40Z")
Thank you everyone for the help! I really appreciate it! ---
**Author:** ![MrGorsky](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex020/user_avatar/forum.logik.tv/mrgorsky/32/1983_2.png) [@MrGorsky](https://forum.logik.tv/u/MrGorsky)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2021, 12:08pm UTC](https://forum.logik.tv/t/23-976-to-pal-am-i-doing-this-right/4274/15 "2021-11-04T12:08:35Z")
Best way is the @andy_dill method, if you’ve got handles, then use them! If you haven’t, then my favoutite way to do this is to just retime the 23.98 master to 25 (tools/utilities/convert rate it to 25 and adjust audio), and then extend shots wherever you can do it neatly. Add time to the packshot/endboard is a favourite, and then look for shots that will timewarp well and only timewarp those shots to make up any time. Then just put the old audio back on. If it’s for broadcast and you do PAL pulldown, it may fail QC due to repeated frames. Depending on who or what is QCing it.