Can no longer Copy Transitions To Track > PQ

Flame timeline has HDR graded media on V1.1. Then an SDR trim xml has been imported from Baselight onto timeline, with auto-generated PQ track immediately under the so-called “HDR” (xml) track.

In 2023 we were able to Copy Transitions To Track (from V1.1) > PQ track, to blade up that PQ track before rendering. This was very useful for various reasons…

Now in Flame 2024.2.1 the option is no longer there, in the exposed list of tracks to copy to. All the others are there as options. Is this by design? Can’t think why it would have been disabled.
@fredwarren @Slabrie

I belive they (Autodesk) removed the ability to add transitions to HDR and PQ tracks. This was in one of their release notes somewhere.

Not sure if that answers your question?

Tylerf is right: we have removed the ability to add FX and transitions to these tracks since we got many users confused by that. Cicero, could you explain the use case to add dissolve on the HDR and the PQ track?

Thanks both. Yes I had totally missed that, but just found it in ‘2024.1 Additional enhancements’:
HDR Workflow : You’re no longer allowed to add a Transition or Timeline FX to the HDR or PQ tracks of a sequence.

We don’t want to copy transitions (dissolves etc) to PQ track - that would be mad! Just the cuts. Our work is longform and we want to render that PQ track before a client session. If we make changes under the PQ track, often the whole layer will become unrendered, not just the changed frames. If it has already been chopped up, then only the changed shots will need to be re-rendered on the PQ layer.

Looks like you can still manually add cuts to the PQ layer, which is obviously time-consuming but what we’ll have to do I guess. Seems odd still to allow cuts to be added one by one, but not copied wholesale from another track.

There’s still an Old Skool way: Copy the track with the transitions to a new layer and duplicate media. Unlink media for that track. Put a copy of the PQ track in a reel by itself. Conform the track with no media pointing to the PQ track reel as the conform source.

I’ve never done HDR, so I don’t now if this is possible with a PQ track, and I “remembered” the method off the top of my head, but it should work.

The ability to do this with one or two clicks was a great improvement when it came out.

Thanks Tim but I don’t think that’ll work. The PQ track contains no media, it’s effectively a Colour Management TLFX on gap/filler, so can’t be linked to like media can.

Ah. Sorry. Interesting how the PQ becomes completely unrendered when with normal gap effect tracks only the portion over the changes become unrendered. For what it’s worth, I don’t experience that with a CM gap fx.

Just wondering what your purpose of rendering the PQ layer is? Would caching your grade and then blowing after the client session still give you the same confidence? Alternately adding a CC layer above the PQ and do a Copy Transitions to Track on that and rendering?

Hello Cicero!
Ok now I better understand the use case. You should not have to render the PQ track. Have you seen playback issue when the PQ track was not rendered?

@ytf I’ve just done a test and the behaviour was the same as yours, it only needed to re-render the frames changed below. But we have seen this in the past and in any case, if you have a 60min timeline with a single slug of CM across the PQ track, it takes maybe a couple of minutes to realise that it only needs to re-render a few seconds of changes. If the layer already had edits, it knows instantly what needs re-rendering. It does this for any FX which span a long timeline, not just PQ CM.

@Robg @Slabrie I never start a client session without all TLFX being rendered. All our work is longform in UHD using EXRs off central storage. Even if media is cached I won’t trust it to play back an hour of timeline with any unrendered FX, without dropping frames.

That’s fair enough, I don’t render a cm or hdr layer as I just don’t have the time to let the machine do that. I’ve very rarely had an issue with that especially if what’s beneath is cached as well.

@cicero we will see what could be done to solve your issue and we will keep you updated.

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Thanks Stéphane! Have submitted an improvement request and linked to this thread:

Thanks a lot!

The ability to copy cut transitions to track will come back in an upcoming service pack. Thanks for reporting the issue and sorry for any inconvenience.

Amazing, thanks Stéphane!

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The functionality has been brought back in the 2025.0.1 version.