I’m a flame newbie and have been pouring through all that FXPHD has to offer the last year trying to myself comfortable with Flame to hopefully start using it as part of my daily toolset.
One thing I feel I haven’t come across much (even with the really great commercial workflow FXHPD class) is how audio is typically handled in a Flame workflow?
Is the audio sent for mix from the offline and then just the mix dropped into the conform, is the raw audio conformed in flame with picture?
One thing I’ve definitely learned about flame is that there are so many ways people use it so hoping to hear how some of you handle your workflow. Thanks!
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personally never do audio in Flame. Do all my mixes/edits etc in ProTools.
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I don’t do professional audio in flame neither.
Final mixes got delivered almost every time by sound department which is then placed to the master timeline.
I’ve sometimes done some layout sound - like you do in offline sessions. But not more.
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Hi Dave,
I think that this is one of the areas that has suffered in the movement of the Smoke timeline across to Flame, in that the timeline has been “harvested” for visual effects and left at really left at that. I think you can go to Smoke 2012 and still have the same audio space? I am not exactly sure how much Smoke (on Mac, etc.) would progress in a parallel universe where it still exist, but sadly audio never gets developed in this one in which we live. For me, I would be ecstatically happy if audio moved at 1/10 the rate of development of the visual. Muting audio segments, like hiding picture segments, has been on my wish list for a while. Also more audio plugins.
In any event, there were a number of really good tutorials, back in the day, that Grant Kay did for audio in Smoke that are directly transposable to Flame. Herein they be:
Cheers
Tony
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Coming from the commercial world, we usually only get final Mix & Splits form the audio department or house. There’s been times when we might need to tweak something, adjust the gain, or add a fade, but that usually gets sent out to be “remixed.” The audio tool in Flame is rather weak than in other programs.
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Thank you all for the replies and insights to your workflows.
Using Flame for mastering, but a real lack of audio interface controls is what got me thinking about it.
I brought in an offline from premiere and it seems to be much harder to link audio sources and ensure a proper match than just with the picture. I’m in the habit of our final conform going back to premiere, so the source audio would still stay in the timeline if it needed to be cleanly collected. Final Mix & Spilts seemed to make the most sense to me for flame since hopefully edit is locked, but it’s always great to hear what the “standard” flow tends to be. Wasn’t sure if having the source audio to archive is something that also happens in flame.
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Wait…what is a locked edit? I feel like I haven’t had one of those for quite some time…
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hahaha, ok…that is 100% true. I mean, I did say “hopefully” 
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Haha. Of course. It always helps to optimistic. As long as it’s not a complete redo, it’s usually not so bad. Unless of course they decide to completely swipe out shots that have been worked on already. Swapping out vfx shots at the last minute usually calls for late nights.
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ahhh… found the audio desk interface. So much to explore in Flame there is so much to miss when learning. This is at least something more of what I was expecting for adjustments and tweaks if needed. Thanks for the tutorial links
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I could count on 1 finger of 1 hand how many times I’ve had more than a committed rendered stereo or 5.1 mix from the audio house in my timeline. Flame has no real way of measuring LKFS and thats just not a muscle that many of us would use. I’d bet that a few of us use it all the time and need more, but, that group would certainly be the exception not the rule. Most artists freak out at the sight of 5.1, let alone a cut in an audio track!
If anybody would know anything about audio in Flame, it’d be either @ytf or Brian Mulligan https://www.linkedin.com/in/brian-mulligan-908aa350/ or @jcharatz69 might.
Flame has taken on a lot of the “Online” work since having a timeline and more editor type artists are needing tools like LKFS monitoring. It’s the small shops like mine that need all of the tools from raw editing through to the mastering out due to the type of work we get. Today it’s a TVC, tomorrow it’s a doco and next week an offline edit.
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how do you handle the LKFS @johnag?
Unfortunately I use Adobe Audition. I did have a feature request some time ago to get LKFS monitoring (at least). I’ll go and look for it and post a vote link.
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I find the right tool for the job is always the best approach.
Flame for visuals, and Pro Tools for audio.
The sequence will depend on the commercial - sometimes i cut the audio before even looking at the visuals, especially when i have to do 10/20s cut downs of a jingle. I need to make the audio flow and sound musical before i worry about fitting the visuals - which is always easier to do.
The other reason for using an audio specific application is the number of specialised plug-ins for both sound quality, compression, effects and metering, that are vital and will never be ported to work in a Flame environment. I need to know the audio track meets all the very strict loudness parameters demanded by the broadcasters, so i export a mix as a stereo wav with everything correct, then in Flame just import it, drop it on the audio track and lock it to prevent further changes happening by mistake.
Luckily, in tv commercials i have never needed a 5.1 mix!
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That certainly is the core of the Flame user-base agreed, and better specialist working practice, but I still find myself popping into the timeline for sound. I collaborate on stuff with a sound designer/musician and as the director of the project I sometimes want to get stuff across to him as presently is the case, so I’ve laid down some further soundtrack elements in addition to his first attempt and he’ll then do all the work in Protools. I’d rather keep it in my Flame timeline, but realise that I’m almost totally an outlier, lone wolf or longtail exception.
Cheers
Tony
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Hey Tony, you’re not the only lone wolf. I try and keep everything in Flame too and seldom have a chance to work with an audio pro. The compressor is my only go to tool. That and gain. It would be nice to have a multitude of presets for EQs but that has not happened. I realize Flame or Smoke was never meant for audio…it’s for visuals and finishing. I’d love to see some small improvements with audio but, I’d rather have the development team continue with ML and tracking improvements.
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Totes. If it is allow one child to survive or the other that we’re playing, then I’ll throw sound under the bus in a heartbeat! With Flame there is limited development work and we’re not talking Adobe Premiere (thankfully!). Apologies for the violent transport inage.
Cheers
Tony
and on the flip side - ProTools is pretty flaky (well…its shit) when it comes to handling audio!